In this episode, we have the pleasure of speaking with Claire Guy, an educational consultant and advocate for equity and inclusivity in schools. Claire's dedication to creating an environment where every student can thrive regardless of their background or identity is truly inspiring.

Claire Guy is a educational leader and significant contributor to Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity (SOGI). With extensive experience in supporting Indigenous, SOGI, English Language Learning, Diverse Abilities, Disabilities, and Anti-Racism education, Claire applies this perspective to her leadership roles. She champions equity, drawing on impactful strategies from her Assistant Superintendent role in Langley B.C. and now as the Executive Director for the BC School Superintendents Association (BCSSA) at a provincial level.

Her website : here

We explore the crucial topic of SOGI (Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity) in education and discuss practical strategies that educators can implement to promote inclusivity and trans-inclusive policies in their classrooms and schools. 

Claire speaks about the challenges teachers face as educators in the 21st century to be adaptable, empathetic, and fully committed to the success of every student. We also discuss the importance of safety and being inclusive as a human right in an educational environment. Throughout the conversation, we examine the concerns around SOGI and safety, the challenges schools commonly face regarding sexual orientation and gender identity and how they can overcome them. 

Claire shares her insights into how teachers can become SOGI inclusive in and outside the classroom. She emphasizes the need for teachers and the community to use the correct pronouns and to examine the resources they are using to ensure that they are inclusive and representative. Join us for this inspiring conversation that offers a guiding light for educators' journey in promoting equity and inclusivity in their classrooms and beyond.

Transcript

Hi, my name is Blue. And I'm the host of this new podcast, the 21st century teacher with livid Earth. And my job is to ensure that our teachers and students get the most out of our programs. This new podcast series is just one of the ways I'm going to be supporting our community of educators, with a monthly conversation with a special guest educator discussing a different aspect of 21st century teaching and learning. 

Today, I'm talking with Claire guy, an experienced Education Consultant with a profound passion for fostering equity, and inclusivity in our schools. Her dedication to creating an environment where every student, regardless of their background, or identity can flourish is truly inspiring. In this episode, she brings her wealth of knowledge and experience to the forefront to help educators like us navigate the crucial path toward more inclusive and equitable education. This is an episode that will empower you to champion equity in your classrooms, and schools. Claire delves into the critical consideration of SOGI sexual orientation and gender identity in education and offers practical strategies that you can implement right away. Claire addresses some of the challenges teachers face as educators in the 21st century that require them to be adaptable, empathetic, and fully committed to the success of every student. Plagueis expertise offers a guiding light for this journey. So I would like to start today by just acknowledging where I am in the world. And I am here in the Slocan Valley, just north of Nelson, British Columbia. And this is actually the traditional territory of the tonight, this build, and that's na. And as well home to around 5000. For the Matey nation, I just want to express my gratitude, to be able to work live and play here and raise my three boys here in a way that they feel a connection to the surroundings, and to the nature, and also an appreciation of first peoples that came before us. So today, I'm really excited to have Claire on the show. Claire, welcome. And thank you for finding time in your busy schedule to join us. 

My pleasure,thank you. And I'm a recent import from British Columbia to New Brunswick. And I am very, very fortunate to be a settler guest in the beautiful lands of the elastic way MC Mack and Passamaquoddy First Nations and since I've moved here, I've tried really hard to live the land acknowledgement, not just say it, but to actually live it. And it's been quite a challenge to find information about it. So one of the things that I'm very committed to is doing research and to learning about the Wabanaki Confederacy, which are the nations in this area, but there's not a lot of information in New Brunswick here. So it's been a challenge, but I'm very committed to it. So I just am grateful to be here. And every day is a new learning. So thank you for that opportunity.

Yeah, thanks. Thanks for sharing. So the focus of our conversations there, what I really wanted to talk to you about and the reason I wanted you on the show was we haven't really covered the sogi community. I say that in the right way, which is an acronym for sexual orientation, and gender identity, which is very much in the news now. And I know it's a part of schools and how teachers are having to kind of embrace some of these issues that are coming up. So this is going to be really helpful to hear from you today. And so actually, before we start talking about that, what is the term and he just explained the term sogi? And I'm curious if that term sogi, this acronym, is this starting to shift to identity to get away from the bad press that sogi itself has. 

I back you up just a little bit, if you don't mind. Cuz that's a big conversation. And first of all, I really want to make sure that the listeners understand that I'm not a member of the 2SLGBTQI+ community. I'm an ally, and a very passionate ally. And I think whenever we do any of this equity work, it's really important that we have representation from the community, as well as allies. And I think that there's a role for both to play. And we need both perspectives. So my role in this conversation is to be the best ally I can be. And, you know, I think when we originally talked about doing this podcast, I went on your website I'm to look at the live it Earth website, and I saw a tagline that said a story for every kid. And that for me, is is very, very impactful. And that's why I, I am such a committed ally. And, and so if you don't mind before I talk about the press and around sogi Are you okay? If I just explain my why? 

Yeah, absolutely. 

So, you know, to your, to your tagline a story for every kid, I really believe that everyone has a story. And for me, part of the reason I'm so passionate about this particular topic is I've had many stories, and many people that have impacted my life in a very positive way around this particular topic. And, and I think that's why I am so passionate about it. And I, if it's okay, I'd like to just share a couple of stories, because I think that will help set the tone for what we're going to talk about. So when I was in university, my best friend was a wonderful Chinese man, he was gay. But he hadn't come out yet. And he came from a very, very traditional family, who I knew well, and well, he was very concerned about how they would react if he told them, and he struggled for about a year, and we talked about it a lot. But he wanted to tell them, but his biggest fear was that they would disown him as their son, and that they would kick him out of the house. And, you know, I talked to him on a regular basis about it. And I said, No, of course they wouldn't, wouldn't do that they love you, you're their, their child. They'll love you no matter what. And so finally, he got the nerve up after, you know, many conversations with me to tell his parents and biggest fears came true. When he did tell them, they did kick him out of the house, and they actually said to him, you are no longer our son. And everything that he feared, came true exactly the way he said it would. And, in fact, he came to live with my family for a short time before he found his own place. And that had an unbelievable impact on me, because I couldn't believe that that would have actually happened and that parents would disown their children. And I never forgave myself for that, quite frankly, he's gone in to be very successful since then. But that story, sort of stuck with me forever, and will stick with me forever. And then I had another story. Again, I'm going to tell this one, if you can indulge me because I think it it will impact what we speak about later on today. And many years later. And this is just another example, I had a colleague. And this is more of a community story. And sort of a story that ended up in tragedy. And very sadly enough, but it didn't inspired some good that came out of it. So it was a parent that I knew a father and he had a teenage son. And I had known the boy since he was a child. And I suspected that he may be gay. And just to let's call the Dad, let's call him John. And John was a very well known and well respected member of the community. But he was outwardly very homophobic, and he would make jokes in front of his son and I could tell that they were hurtful to him. But at the same time, this was going on. We there was another family in the community that that they all knew each other and they all all the kids grew up together and let's call that other dad, David. And David's son had a same age. As John said, David's son had some serious mental health issues a lot going on. And very, very sadly, one day committed suicide as a teenager, and he was the same age at the time as Johnson and they knew each other. And John was actually the person who found David's son, it was horrible story, devastating to the entire community, and particularly impactful for John, because John son was still alive. And David's son, of course, had died very tragically. And so at that point, John had a choice to make, you know, and he could choose to appreciate and embrace his son for who he was and the fact that he was still alive, and stop with the homophobic slurs. And because he was driving his son further and further away. And the good news is that he did. And this was a real turning point for John and, and I think the loss of David ‘s son had such a profound impact on him, he became his son's biggest supporter, and Sam, very proud of him. And that story, to me also had a huge impact. Because, you know, it wasn't until there was such a loss, for people to realize the harm and the damage that can happen when we reject people. So it was, it was a very, very tragic story. But, you know, some good came out of it. And now the relationship that John has with his son is, is wonderful, but it took something so tragic to turn that around. So when we talk about the term SOGI, and and, you know, the bad precedents had SOGI, right stands for sex, sexual orientation, gender identity, and SOGI is not a bad acronym or a bad term at all it the language changes all the time. And you'll hear lots of different versions of those terms. You know, I right now use 2SLGBTQI+ but there's lots of different acronyms terms. And language change, and it evolves over time. But the community, it has existed forever. And, you know, people are people and, you know, I really think that the, the, the identity piece is more important than the term we use to describe it. And so, you know, I will change my language based on the audience that I'm talking to, just because I want to get away from the labeling. And I've changed it many times over the years, because, you know, it does evolve and change. But but the point is, you know, we're talking about identity. I don't know if that answers your question. 

Yeah, no, absolutely. Because I feel like there's been a lot of bad press, with the recent protests in communities, you know, these walks. We've seen a lot of parents who've been coming out in certain areas, in some regions, opposed to the teaching, about sexual orientation, and gender identity. So what would you tell those protesters?

Well, you know, again, I believe and this this is my personal beliefs here is I think people fear what they don't understand. And, you know, if something is unfamiliar, or if there's something that challenges your own belief system, or cultures or traditions or values, it creates a sense of discomfort. And that's normal. If there's something new or different, how you respond to that is, you know, it can go either way. And, you know, when you hear, I remember being on a playground, on supervision one day, and I heard a six year old making homophobic slurs, well, you know, and calling other children names, and I'm thinking, you know, where's the six year old learning that you know, what is going on in the home? Or, you know, or in the community? Where, where are they learning now, and we need to ask, and, and I really believe that, you know, so much hate and misunderstanding comes from a place of fear. And so if, if we educate and create awareness and teach it, my hope, and I realized that it perhaps is a little optimistic, but my hope is that that we dispel those fears. Because those protesters are, I really believe are the vocal minority. They are not. They are not the majority of people. Unfortunately, sometimes the majority is silent. And that's why I believe in the role of Allah is and that we need, you know, we don't want the vocal minority, you'd be the loudest voice. Because those protests are about, hey, they're about extremism, and they perpetuate bias. And, you know, we all have bias it within us caught conscious and unconscious. But, you know, that hate language really inflames people, and it promotes bias. And, you know, when I'm having conversations with people about this topic, I try to take the emotion out of it. And and I'll use the example of being right handed or left handed. And so for example, you know, if if I'm a left handed person, that doesn't make me a bad person, it just means it's who I am, you know, if I'm a right handed person, I'm a right handed person. And, you know, for example, if you look around the world right now is built for right handed people. And I'm not a left handed person, my husband is and and he makes me notice things all the time, things like door handles, and, you know, things that we sort of take for granted in the world. Well, if you're even writing when you're taught to write in school, you know, so you don't teachers want you to write with your right hand very often books are created that way, and the world is just built for right-handed people. And if if you were left-handed, and I said, well, I need you to be right hand and you can't be left-handed. Well, that would be ridiculous. And I think most people would think, well, that's silly. That's ridiculous. You know, you're left-handed is who you are. It's just, you know, it's just part of your identity. So why should this be any different? And I think when you think about it that way, people kind of go, oh, yeah, I mean, you know, I was born right-handed, somebody else was born left-handed. That's not doesn't make them a bad person. It's not a disease I'm going to catch I'm not going to catch their left-handedness. You know, and, and, you know, I see you smiling and you think about it, it's such a ridiculous example. But it makes a point. And I think that's, why I like to teach it the same way.

No, I like it. And I'm going to be really honest right now. So I have an 18-month-old four-year-old too. If I see the 18 months, you're trying to do something with his left hand, I just have this reaction where I want to take the spoon and put it in his right hand and make sure he's doing with his right hand. If he's left-handed, he's left-handed, but it's just that it's just inbuilt in me, it's like we you should be doing things with your right hand without really thinking about it. And just, uh, yeah, anyway, I just found myself noticing these little things, young children because I become a certain way. Because left-handed was always Yeah, like you say, it was not for norm, necessarily

No. And, you know, when, when you think about it, does it make sense to be hateful, or fear somebody who is left-handed, you know, back to the age of witches, and, you know, burning the stick. And I mean, it's so silly. But it's, you know, it's who you are, is part of your identity. And, you know, and and when we ask people to just ignore it, or pretend it doesn't exist or to go away, you're asking them to not be true to themselves, and not authentic. 

Andthat being said, so, you know, in your mind, and the conversations that you have and what you see going on in your school districts. Why is this such an important topic? I mean, such a simple question. But what is this so important?

For me, this is about being inclusive, and it's about safety. And, and that is, you know, when we have these conversations, I am never going to ask or expect anyone to change their values or their traditions or their cultural beliefs. That would just be wrong. But I am going to ask that all people expect a safe learning environment. And I think, you know, every child deserves that and I think every parent who says goodbye to their child every morning and says, you know, Bye, love, have a good day. needs to feel confident that when they trust their children to the school, that they know they're going to be safe, and that they're going to have a good experience. They're going to be safe. They're going to be allowed to be who they are. So if I send my left-handed child to school, that teacher isn't going to force them to write with a right hand. 

Yeah, yeah. So what are some of those concerns around in relation to safety? With SOGI?

Well, you know, I think it there's a lot of research around this. But you know, and then you depending on what source, you say, but the latest source that I read, you know, about 65%, of 2sLGBTQIA+ kids do not feel safe at school. And there's a whole bunch of reasons for that. Youth who belong to that community, are sadly, at a way higher rate for substance abuse, and mental health issues, they have the highest rate of suicide of any group of youth. And, you know, they're at risk for bullying, intimidation. But very sadly, like the two stories that I started with today, sometimes those students don't have the support at home. And so it exacerbates the problem and the safety risks for them. And that's why it's really important that school become a safe place because it's not always safe at home for them.

That's a really good point. I really glad the you brought that up, actually, and not something I would necessarily have thought of. So one day in trading safer and more inclusive education environments. As you mentioned, what are some of those key challenges? The schools are commonly facing around that. And how can they overcome those challenges? Because I'm sure through your conversations and the networking that you do and your roles over the years, you've had these conversations, so I'm curious what comes up?

Yeah, oh, and there's lots and quite frankly, to be honest, there are some things that you can change, and there's some things that you can't. And, you know, some of the obvious ones are, depending on where you are in the country, you know, and what your schools are like, some of the buildings are old, some of the structures are old. And you know, it's easy to say, well, we should have, you know, gender neutral washrooms, and all of our schools and gender neutral change rooms and things. And sometimes that's physically and logistically easier to do than others. You know, I know that in in some of the newer build schools, they are building, gender neutral washrooms. But if you've got a very old building, and there's not very many washrooms, it becomes physically harder to do. It's not impossible by any stretch, but it requires more effort. So, you know, one of the challenges that I always ask teachers and all educators to think about principals, vice principals, system leaders is to say, Where are the safe spaces in your school? Or in your school district? Where is it safe? And where is it not safe? And, you know, some of the places that we think are safe aren't for for our 2SLGBTQIA+ kids. And so, I mean, the obvious ones are washrooms. But actually, sometimes people forget changing rooms for PE PE is a subject that a lot of those students don't want to take because it's uncomfortable, and it's a place where there have in the past been, you know, real issues of bullying. So looking at your buildings and where your safe spaces Where's not safe, and our app, are there gender neutral spaces that you can create. So you know, the physical environment and is the playground safe stairwells? You know, there's there's a whole bunch of places that maybe that group of kids don't feel safe and I'm what are we doing about it? You know, signage is another thing, you know, what, you know, are we saying boys washroom, girls washroom, or is it just a washroom? And you know, that may sound really silly. But those are big, big deal. The language we use, the signage we use all of those things in our environment, send a message is, Are we welcoming? Are we being inclusive and those norms are changing and was building so, you know, people are, you know, evolving and changing and things are becoming more culturally sort of accessible, I guess. But it's taken us a long time to get where are we at and we're not we're certainly not there yet. One of the examples I like to use when we talk about this kind of thing is challenges when you think about it, and I'm dating myself now, but I'm old enough to remember when you could actually smoke on an aeroplane. And there was a smoking section at the back of the plane. You know, when you think about that. Now, if you asked anybody, or told people that you were thinking of smoking on, they would think you're crazy, like, that's just so not even remotely in people's realm of thinking now, but but it wasn't that long ago that you could do that. You know, and so, those, those cultural norms change. And, you know, I use drinking, driving as an example, as well for that. I mean, I remember, you know, that time is when people would have a lot to drink, and they would think nothing of grabbing the car keys and getting in the car and driving. Well, we know it's not okay to do that. And I'm not saying people still don't do it, but I'm saying the cultural norm and expectations around that. It's not okay, anymore to do. That doesn't mean that it's not an issue still. But you know, people norms are changing, and that's a good thing. It's just that, you know, here's another area where we need to focus. 

So, in terms of in the classroom, with the teacher, how can they create an inclusive experience? I know, maybe not just even just in the classroom, but in and out of the classroom. Like, does that fall down? Like, is that down to language? Yeah, what are some other ideas around that? Yeah.

So yes, and it starts, it starts with language, it starts with being inclusive. I mean, on my, my people can't see my picture now. But I, you know, Hi, my name is Claire. And I introduced, you know, I use she her l pronouns. And it says that on my little zoom, identity piece, and, you know, we, names, pronouns, those are important, those things matter to people, because it's part of our identity, it's who we are. And, you know, we, as a teacher, we need to ask students, what's your pronouns? You know, how do you like, you know, how do you like to be referred to, and you can't assume we have to ask, you know, and so, even just how we introduce ourselves, Hi, my name is you know, and I use she her l pronouns, that sends a message very loud and clear that you're going to be welcome in my, my learning environment, and I'm going to respect who you are, and allow you to be your authentic self, you know, you see it now on people's email signatures, or business cards, you know, that that's, again, another example of a cultural norm. As far as in the learning environment, look at the resources that you're using, as, as a teacher, you know, people want to see themselves represented in their resources. So, you know, we want to create awareness of all identities and all intersectionalities. And it's not just about sexual orientation and gender identity, it's, you know, it's, we want to see people of color, we want to see diverse abilities and disabilities, represented in our books, in our videos in our social media. So when you're selecting books, you know, are you selecting a book with mom and dad? Or are you selecting a book with a mom and a mom, or a dad and a dad? You know, what's on your walls? But you know, very often I'll go into a school and, and what's on your walls? What's in your hallway says a lot about what you value. You know, so what are you showing to the outside world? What posters do you have in your walls? You know, do you have a GSA in your school or a rainbow club? Do you have rainbow stickers? You know, kids know that those symbols and if you have a rainbow sticker on your door, kids know that they're welcome. This is a class posture more, I'm going to feel welcomed, and I'm going to be able to be who I am. And, you know, one of the things I think educators can do that's really powerful is put yourself in the position of that learner. If I was that learner, if I was that transgender child, or if I was that person, how would I feel in this space? And what I see myself reflected in the learning resources on the walls and the posters in the language that people are using. It's very basic, but it takes some time. If it's a new thing for you is you know, it's a journey and it's, it's everybody's in a different place, and it's okay to be in a different place, but it's about creating an awareness. So that You know, we start to think about it. 

Yeah,no, absolutely. And this might sound stupid, but what are the benefits of being equitable? When it comes to education? Like, is this? Is there a process or a series of steps that we're going to be putting in place? 

Well, first of all, it's not stupid at all. And secondly, it's really not an option. And I think this is where going back to a place of, of misunderstanding. And that's why education and awareness is so important because you know, sexual orientation and gender identity is a protected, right is a protected human right, in legislation in 1996. Sexual orientation and gender identity became grounds for discrimination. So it's not an option, and it's not new, you know, this has been around for a while. And there's been lots of pushback and lots of backlash, again, going back to a place of misunderstanding, but, you know, it is the law, there's no question, and it's not an option. And, you know, sadly, there are still some places in the world where being gay is a crime. And, you know, in some extreme places, it's actually punishable by death. There's an amazing map of the world where different colors represent different countries, where sexual orientation and gender identity is not as appreciated as it is in North America. And I'm not saying North American Canada, is we're off to the races by any stretch, but we're in a much better place, but it is the law, it's not an option. In the workplace, in education, it's a protected, right under the charter. So I think, you know, it's about education, it's about compassion, and understanding, and moving forward on that, on that journey.

And so some parents might think kids should not hear about sexual orientation, as they might be too young. So what is considered too young and when our kids ready?

So I'm gonna go back to the right-handed left-handed example, and you talked about your 18-month-old child. So your 18-month-old child probably already has a sense of whether they're right-handed or left-handed or not, they might not call it that they might not be even aware of it, but they may just feel more comfortable picking things up with their left hand or playing with their toys with their left hand. And so, you know, the research says that children have a sense of their own gender identity, starting around the age of you know, between the ages of three and five. Kids know who they are, and I think, you know, people who misunderstand who are fearful of it, or who this doesn't fit with their cultural values. Try to, it creates discomfort for them, especially if they're noticing it to their own children. And, and you know, that they're hoping that this is just a phase that, you know, their child is going through, you know, or, you know, it's normal for kids to want to play dress up. Well, that really concerned some parents, you know, they don't want their children playing dress up. Because they're thinking they're gonna, you know, this, if we teach this, it's going to encourage students to be gay, or it's going to encourage or be trendy to be transgender. And I mean, again, it that's just such a ridiculous way to think, again, if you think about the right-hand left-handed thing, if, you know if I'm naturally right-handed, am I going to say okay, why I'm going to become left hand because I think it looks fun, or it's going to be cool, or, you know, it's just, it's not going to be natural for me, it's not gonna be comfortable for me. If I get forced to be left-handed, but I'm a right-handed person, can I? Maybe, you know, fake my way through it, probably. But it's not who I really am. You know, so when we again, I keep using that example, because it's a safe way to explain a really hard concept or some people. 

Yeah,no, exactly. So till our teachers ready to tackle such a subject, like did they feel equipped?

Good question. I think they're absolutely ready to tackle it and teachers are a greatest resource. You know, however, they need and want to feel supported, and they need to feel confident that the system that they're there, you know, system leaders or school leaders, district leaders have their back. Because it is such a, you know, a hot button issue out there for some folks and that vocal minority tend to take up a ton of airtime and space, but they are the minority. And teachers need to feel confident that there's a unified support behind them. And that they are doing the right thing again, going back to it's the law, it's it's the right thing to do. And kids are very accepting. Kids are way more accepting than the adults. They don't have an issue with it. It's it's, it's the, it's the big people, not the little people that are

The intersection of safety and SOGI. Like, it is a complex issue, as someone mentioned, because it doesn't just involve the educators, it's the students, the parents, the broader community, the neighborhood, as if, you know, you mentioned that earlier as well with the tragic story. How can schools engage all of the stakeholders in meaningful conversations and actions to improve the safety of thes students?

Oh, that's a big question. And, you know, I certainly hope that I am not saying this as simple or easy, because I know it's not and that, you know, in, in the short time that we have today, I'm just trying to highlight and surface some of the key considerations. But you know, I think, really, it involves a unified, supportive, compassionate stance, you know, we need to be, we need to be respectful of other opinions, we may not agree with them, but we need to respect them, we need to understand where they're coming from. We need to educate and create awareness, again, going back to the smoking on an aeroplane, we know that it's just a very dangerous thing to do. It's not smart to do that. And we know more now than we did that. And, you know, once you know, something, you can't really unknow it. And so it's about debunking the myths, it's about normalizing something that is, has been around forever, time immemorial, you know, and being accepting and being and treating people the way we would want to be treated and setting those norms and those boundaries, that, while I may not agree with your values, I think everybody can agree that this is about safety. And it's about, like I said, you say goodbye to your child in the morning, you expect that they're going to be safe, they're going to be allowed to be who they are at school, and they're going to come home, as supported as their as they left at the beginning of the day. And, you know, again, going back, I'm not trying to change anybody's opinions are values. It's not about that it's or, you know, their religious beliefs, I'm trying to make the school environment safe for all children, where they can be their right-handed or their left-handed selves, and be appreciated for who they are. And I think, you know, it sounds very Pollyanna. It sounds like a broken record. But I really believe that and, you know, I think, being positive about it and not, you know, getting rid of the noise, getting rid of that vocal minority, to allow the teachers the space and the time they need and then to support them with professional learning and to support the conversations and, and they're hard conversations are not easy, and they take time and you change one person at a time, one communication at a time, one interaction, one relationship at a time. But over time, again, going back to, you know, the story that I told about the very tragic one, you know, at some point, we need to appreciate people for who they are, and when they're with us. So, you know, that's like I said, I think it's it needs to come from a place of compassion and understanding.

Don't I really like that you just bring it right back down to safety of kids. Because it's pretty hard to argue against, but and it's so and this is just a thought that popped in my head. You mentioned professional learning. I was asking around about his meaningful conversations within the community and education and the stakeholders. I don't know what this looks like, but our counselors, psychologists, professionals outside the of education that are experts in you know, like, for my own family, I lean into that professional help sometimes just to have a better understanding, and to do the best job that I can as a parent. So in that regard, is that happening? are professionals being brought in to support teachers in that way? In the bigger conversation?

Absolutely. And, you know, I think it really, quite frankly, depends on where you are, what resources and where, like, where you physically are in the country, and, and what resources you have available to you. And when I say resources, I'm talking about people, you know, there's many, many organizations that are just have outstanding people and support, there's lots of support out there. But there has to be the desire, you know, to take advantage of it. And there's lots of, you know, there's lots of great resources and stories out there and lots of success stories. You know, and I'm noticing really positive change, that, you know, the world is changing, and it's changing in a good way. And, you know, we see it, I was in a bath store the other day. And there was a sign outside the front door. It was a rainbow sticker in it said, Everyone is welcome here. I've seen that sign on churches, which, you know, maybe 20 years ago, I don't know if I would have seen that. You know, one of my, it's a bit of a running joke in our family, but one of my guilty pleasures, at Christmas time is watching the Hallmark Christmas movies. And I was watching one last night, and it was really refreshing to see a kiss between two gentlemen. And you know, I'm not sure even five years ago, I would have seen that on the Hallmark station. And I'm not using that and holding that up as an example. But I'm just saying, The world is changing around us and, you know, shows like Schitt's  Creek, and you know, some of the things like I said, even my Hallmark movie last night I, it made me smile, because I'm thinking this is this is just the right thing to do. And, you know, we're seeing rainbow sidewalks. And, you know, stairs and pride parades. And you know, I remember when the pride parades years ago, they were there was nobody going to them, or they were big political events. Now, it's it's very competitive, to get into the Pride Parade, you know, there's big waiting lists for people want to participate. So, you know, it's changing. And it's it's a good change. But, you know, like I said, I think we need to pay attention to the positive, not to all the noise. And I know, it's easy to say that, and it's very hard to do that. But that's our role as leaders, and, you know, we need to create those safe spaces for teachers to do the good work that they want to do. And we need to support them in their efforts to do that.

Yeah, so building on that thought, are there any success stories or examples of any specific schools or districts without maybe mentioning them that have successfully promoted the safety and inclusive tips? Yeah, I just wonder what any takeaways you could leave us with.

There's lots and again, it's really hard to advance and specifics without identifying particular places, but, you know, a lot of districts now, I mean, it's very rare that we get to build new schools. But when we do if we actually have the money to be able to do that, that's build a gender neutral washroom, you know, and, and schools are doing that. And I remember, oh, about 10 years ago, being in that place where there was a new school that was being built, and not all the parents were happy because there was the school district decided to build a gender neutral washroom. And, you know, it was a new concept for parents and it was a big deal. And, and then when you think about it, you think but is your washroom in your house segregated or is it just gender neutral, you know, and it only gets segregated. You know, when you get outside of your home, but in your home, your washrooms Is your washroom, you know, and it took a long time for that community to kind of embrace that. And now it's just sort of normal. So, you know, like, and I'm using that as an as an example. But things like GSAs, you know, gay straight alliances, or rainbow clubs, diversity clubs, it used to be a big deal to have a GSA in, in schools. And and we know that GSAs the research shows that it's not just, it doesn't create just a safer community for the LGBTQ kids, but for all kids, they have, you know, it makes them all feels or more students feel safer. And, and that used to be a high school thing. Now we're taking it down to a younger level, we're taking it to middle school and elementary school where we have rainbow clubs are diversity clubs, and all those different names for it. But and that's, that's an excellent success story. Because what we're doing is we're building that understanding and compassionate, a way younger age, which is really where it needs to start, which is why I go back to, you know, kids, no young, and we need to support them earlier. So there's so many examples of those kinds of things. I was at a youth forum, in the summer for an conference, and there was about 20 youth on stage, and every single student just introduced themselves with their pronouns. And that was just how they were used to introducing themselves because that's what they do in their school. And it's just normal for them. You know, Hi, my name is Claire, and I use a t shirt, you know, or she, she her l pronouns. And, and that was really refreshing to see. So, you know, it's changing, it's changing, and it's, it's happening everywhere, and there's pockets of brilliance everywhere. It's just, and everyone's on a different journey in a different place. As long as we're moving, that's what I ask.

But thank you so much. You've got me thinking already now, because I noticed your resume, as you already mentioned, does have indeed, she her owl, mine has teacher support, it does not have my pronouns. So I definitely have work to do. And yeah, again, as a parent with young children is something that's undoubtedly going to come up for us as well. So yeah, no, I appreciate it. It's other things have gone good conversation, to have a good conversation to continue having, and to be open around it. And just to bring it back to that simple piece of pitch should feel safe no matter what. I think that's a really good way to end.

Now, thank you for having me. And again, I, you know, no expert. I'm just somebody who cares deeply and is passionate. And like I said, I just want to be a good ally. And that's what I hope. That's my hope. And that's what keeps me, you know, doing this and being hopeful about it, because I do see really positive change. And I'm paying attention to the positive change as opposed to the negative voice. So thank you so much for making space and time for this conversation. And I hope I've been somewhat helpful. So thank you.

Right, thank you so much. Thanks for joining us on the 21st century teacher, and we look forward to see you next time. Please do subscribe so you don't miss out on the next show. And also don't forget to check out our fantastic online learning platform, which is Live ID dot Earth. Thanks again and we'll see you soon.